Ethanol in Ontario

[Christopher Sears]

Well, I may be the only person interested in this right now but if you are interested or have information to share about the state of the law(s) in this province please join in.

I have made pre;liminary inquiries of the government information agencies but they were not helpful. I guess I need to dig a little deeper. No doubt it will be suitably complicated to get permission to make my own ethanol, but who knows.

I do know that making your own beer and wine is perfectly legal, so why not distilling ethanol?

[Perfesser]

In Ont myself. Burlington
Same stonewall with the legal folks.
Talking to a farmer who is interested enough to devote some acres for experimentation. Building a still for the same.

[Christopher Sears]

Hello Perfesser;

I have done some talking to neighbours and one lady told me that there are 2 distilleries for ethanol that she knows of down near Brantford, on Hwy 5. Both are on farms so it appears that I may have to visit them to find out more.

By the way, I found out that there are a least 4 fuel stations carrying E-85 in the province. 2 in Ottawa, and 1 each in Guelph and Chatham. I found the info on the "National Ethanol Vehicle Coalition" website, "www.e85refueling.com". There is a spot for checking out locations in Canada.

Personally, I have never seen any in and around Toronto nor out Oshawa and Peterborough way. They may be there but....who knows? I keep asking people, but no one has ever seen any for sale.

[Angie Rinehart]

Christopher, I live in Brantford....so if you have location/contact details I would be happy to call on them for you and save you the trek down here...I would also need a list of your questions.

[Christopher Sears]

Hello Angie;

The person I spoke to gave me these directions: she always drives on Hwy #5 from Toronto. After passing Flamborough and Waterdown (maybe not in that order? I can't remember), just before reaching St.George, there is a farm on the north side (right hand side driving from Toronto) with a sign announcing that they are producing ethanol. She also read in the local Paris paper about a local farm that was going into ethanol production. She suggests asking at the local Home Hardware. I have sent an email to the paper asking for info which I will post here as soon as I hear back from them.

As to questions we all would like to ask: I would like to know who they have to deal with to get permission to set up the still in the first place. Is it provincial? federal? both? Special permits or inspections by fire department? Maybe get a contact number or email from them so we can all put together a list and then you could act as our spokesperson to forward the info requests to them. I have read through most of David Blume's book which gives a lot of info about the process of making ethanol, but what I really want to find out is what do I have to do to not get arrested by the RCMP or OPP!!

[Angie Rinehart]

I will go out there as soon as possible...though it will probably be a few days.

[Angie Rinehart]

Hi Christopher,

Sorry it has taken so long to get back to you, I'm temporarily without wheel so have to depend on friends.

I finally went out to Highway 5 on Saturday but couldn't find the place...we went from St George to Troy. I'm hoping to get another vehicle shortly, so if you still need the info I'll go back out there and further up Hwy 5.

Do you have any idea what a farm still would look like? Earlier Saturday we were driving up hwy 53/2, the road from Hamilton to Brantford, and passed an old grain silo that has had some recent renovations done to it plus it now has a chimney with smoke or steam coming out...do you think this could be a still? If so, this would be easier to get too.

[Christopher Sears]

Thanks Angie for giving it a try. I am sorry my directions were not good enough. I think these places may be the ones run by IGPC. Take a look at the website info in my comment further down this page. Maybe it will save another fruitless drive out into the country.

[Perfesser]

It would be worth the visit to find out how they're allowed to sell, who their market is.
Bought a diesel a few years back so I thought I wasn't in the market for ethanol myself but listening to the C2C Nov 13 show I may yet be able to. Have to look into that.
At the time I thought it was the best way to cut the oil companies out of the loop using straight veggie oil. I have been using biodiesel, you can get that in Milton. It's only B20(20% bio and 80% reg diesel).
Still have a year on the warranty before I want to convert.

"making your own beer and wine is perfectly legal, so why not distilling ethanol"
It's easy to poison yourself and others by drinking poorly made moonshine = government intervention.

[Kelly]

Hello Christopher and Perfessor

Well, you are not the only people interested in this.... Count me in!
I am going to be spreading the news, pointing out the websites and research and...
doing some checking with the government as well. I would like a filling station close by.
Would you like to collaborate???
I just found out we have a Station in Guelph. It is only 70 miles from me but worth the drive to find out more information....
We have everything to gain here.
I really liked the story Dave mentioned in the interview about harnessing the vapours coming up the
chimney of Bakeries. We have so many Bakeries!!!!

Regards,
Kelly

[Christopher Sears]

Hello Kelly;

I think we already are collaborating! Thanks for joining the group and sharing info. Notwithstanding the fact that I would love to find a way to use waste to make ethanol here in the city, it probably makes more sense to take it one step at a time, by first setting up a cooperative fueling station here in my own city using ethanol produced by already established distilleries. David Blume mentions that as a good way to start. That is part of the solution at least - just making ethanol available to people. Each of us here could be the starting point of a cooperative in our own hometowns. By sharing info here we could be the start of a group/coalition of cooperatives across the province & country for that matter.

[Christopher Sears]

Hello everyone;

I just spoke to the Service Canada 1-800 line and they tell me that when they ask for info on their data base, they are directed to provincial information sites. It appears that the regulation of alcohol is strictly a provincial matter. Well, its a start!

I have also spoken to Dr. Zahir Islam, of Agricultural Food Policy, at the Ontario Ministry of Agriculture, Food and Rural Affairs. He has informed me that there is a provincial regulation called "Ethanol in Gasoline" Ont. Reg. 535/05 passed Jan 2007. It apparently contains sections on the production of ethanol. He also told me that the Ministry of Environment has the lead role in the entire ethanol issue. I am sure that those of you in the other provinces will find out similar info when you contact your provincial ministries.

Dr. Islam also gave me the names of some ethanol producers in Ontario and suggests that I contact them directly. They are: Greenfield Ethanol; Suncor; Collingwood Ethanol; and Integrated Grain Producers Co-op. I am going to start with IGP. If anyone else has time to contact the others that would be great. I suggest that we keep each other informed so that we don't all call the same place and get them pissed off at us!

[Christopher Sears]

Hello again;

Check out this website: http://www.coopscanada.coop/CDI/pdf/Ag-CDI_approved_projects.pdf
It is a list of federal grants showing several ethanol producer groups from across the country.

Here is another one of interest to Ontarians: http://www.omafra.gov.on.ca/english/infores/releases/2006/061506.html
This is a provincial government news release on what they are doing, etc.

This is a site where the feds disclose grants - in this case to IGPC: http://www4.agr.gc.ca/AAFC-AAC/display-afficher.do?id=1212173408600...

Here is an article on the BC coop website concerning Ontario policy to ethanol: http://www.bcca.coop/news/ethanol-producers-downplay-potential-prov...

and lastly, here is the IGPC website: http://www.igpc.ca/

Enjoy!